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NADS step by step guide

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In the worst case scenario I'll try to fill in those blank images from my own collecting if Dronus can't be bothered anymore. He hasn't been around lately and that includes all other Patrol forums.

Regards

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Hi,

     New here to this forum.

I have a 2005 patrol and looking to fit the nads system to it.

Does anyone have a copy of the pictures that are at the beginning of this thread that show the step by step procedure of installing this system and in what order i should start the process.

Thanks in advance.

Craig

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I have restored the images into the original posts for you. The original poster used PhotoBucket, which has since stopped providing free image hosting. I was able to upload the images directly to the forum, where they should stay forever.

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2 hours ago, admin said:

I have restored the images into the original posts for you. The original poster used PhotoBucket, which has since stopped providing free image hosting. I was able to upload the images directly to the forum, where they should stay forever.

Cool thanks for that.

One more question. I have an egr shim ready to go in. Do i wait until i have my boost and egt gauges and put them in at the same time??

Ta

Craig

 

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Install boost and EGT gauges first. You will need them to setup boost control correctly and you need to have some sort of boost control in there if you are shimming EGR as well.

 Alternatively you can consider re-map of engine ECU which means no more limp problems as 05 Di is very sensitive to changes in boost control (which will get affected with EGR shim installation) which means you will be constantly playing with boost control, trying to tune it out but it is a loosing battle especially on series 4 because beast behaves completely different subject to ambient temperatures.  Series 4 is not as NADS friendly as earlier versions .

Indeed NADS is a part of complex web of fiddling with the car until you're no longer expecting issues.

Every change you introduce will affect the outcome. 

My order of things would be:

1. Boost and EGT gauges

2. Electric fuel lift pump with fuel cooler and spill line bypass (lots of benefits with added IP protection) and Provent catch can (oil separator)

3. ECU-remap (alert! heaps of power but also with a lot of black smoke under full pedal) with max boost controller and/or retaining factory turbo solenoid or  manual boost control with needle valve and Dawes/Tilix valves

4. Glow plug timer mod (or just manual overide with momentary switch)

5. intake hose and air cleaner lid mod

6. EGR shim (not needed if ECU re-mapped)

Regards

 

Edited by Rumcajs

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On 8/24/2017 at 10:33 PM, Rumcajs said:

Install boost and EGT gauges first. You will need them to setup boost control correctly and you need to have some sort of boost control in there if you are shimming EGR as well.

 Alternatively you can consider re-map of engine ECU which means no more limp problems as 05 Di is very sensitive to changes in boost control (which will get affected with EGR shim installation) which means you will be constantly playing with boost control, trying to tune it out but it is a loosing battle especially on series 4 because beast behaves completely different subject to ambient temperatures.  Series 4 is not as NADS friendly as earlier versions .

Indeed NADS is a part of complex web of fiddling with the car until you're no longer expecting issues.

Every change you introduce will affect the outcome. 

My order of things would be:

1. Boost and EGT gauges

2. Electric fuel lift pump with fuel cooler and spill line bypass (lots of benefits with added IP protection) and Provent catch can (oil separator)

3. ECU-remap (alert! heaps of power but also with a lot of black smoke under full pedal) with max boost controller and/or retaining factory turbo solenoid or  manual boost control with needle valve and Dawes/Tilix valves

4. Glow plug timer mod (or just manual overide with momentary switch)

5. intake hose and air cleaner lid mod

6. EGR shim (not needed if ECU re-mapped)

Regards

 

Hi.

Question

Why do we need the electric fuel lift pump? and what would be the best one to get? and also would getting a chip do the same as getting the ecu remaped??

 

 

 

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On 9/30/2017 at 9:56 AM, Craig Holman said:

Hi.

Question

Why do we need the electric fuel lift pump? and what would be the best one to get? and also would getting a chip do the same as getting the ecu remaped??

 

 

 

G'day,

An aditional electric lift pump is needed because built in supply pump in the injection pump of Bosch/Zexel VP44 is struggling to deliver enough fuel especially at lower RPM for all the duties the fuel is required to do e.g. combustion, cooling, hydraulic actuation and lubrication. As it is it just barely keep up and even then only at higher RPM from about 1800 up subject to load.

Most commonly people use either Carter 4600/4601 series pumps ==> Carter 4601 in GU Patrol ( I fully recommend you watch/follow rest of the videos/info from Ross aka "Geeyoutoo" )

Another pump is Walbro FRB13 series. Walbro has an advantage of being flow through pump (that means if it stops working fuel can go through) whereas with Carter one has to make by-pass circuit in such case...

If you are wondering why it feels so sluggish on take offs that's what is the cause, as the RPMS are low there is not enough fuel to actuate injection advance mechanism sofuel  injection is retarded and the response is hence slow.

Then there is cooling and lubrication part, as any starvation will start ruining the injection pump which is very expensive to fix, some would argue that is not even designed to be rebuilt especially the electronics side.

I can tell you that just by fitting the lift pump I noticed improvement in low RPMs response. Another positive event is that if you your own servicing priming the fuel system is a breeze as well.

As with the chip vs remap, there is no contest remap wins heands down.  I have Safari Dtronic chip sitting on the shelf as a paper weight now, sure it made some improvements over stock setup but nothing sort of expectations the glossy ads make it up to be. See this ==> NIssan Patrol ECU re-map

The problem with GU4 series ZD30 is that Nissan was rather too conservative on the emission side and made control system to go in to limp mode at slightest whiff of sensory overload so just fitting diesel chip will cause issues instantly. Fitting Dawes and needle valve causes the same so any gain power/performance will come back adn bite if the limps are not taken care of....

Re-mapped ECU has no such problems as re-map removes those silly limps and other performance limiting parameters set there to comply with whatever idiotic ideas they had at the time.

Honestly, the re-map output is so much that it makes me wondering what it does to the engine reliability even though ZD30 has it pretty low from the factory anyway.

To summarize, re-map is less hassle, cost about the same as piggy back chip and as long as you don't mind black smoke the performance output is nothing short of incredible I kid you not. And as someone who had a fair share of mods induced limps and attempts to beat them I would not go back to original factory tune ever again.

Regards

Edited by Rumcajs

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18 hours ago, Rumcajs said:

G'day,

An aditional electric lift pump is needed because built in supply pump in the injection pump of Bosch/Zexel VP44 is struggling to deliver enough fuel especially at lower RPM for all the duties the fuel is required to do e.g. combustion, cooling, hydraulic actuation and lubrication. As it is it just barely keep up and even then only at higher RPM from about 1800 up subject to load.

Most commonly people use either Carter 4600/4601 series pumps ==> Carter 4601 in GU Patrol ( I fully recommend you watch/follow rest of the videos/info from Ross aka "Geeyoutoo" )

Another pump is Walbro FRB13 series. Walbro has an advantage of being flow through pump (that means if it stops working fuel can go through) whereas with Carter one has to make by-pass circuit in such case...

If you are wondering why it feels so sluggish on take offs that's what is the cause, as the RPMS are low there is not enough fuel to actuate injection advance mechanism sofuel  injection is retarded and the response is hence slow.

Then there is cooling and lubrication part, as any starvation will start ruining the injection pump which is very expensive to fix, some would argue that is not even designed to be rebuilt especially the electronics side.

I can tell you that just by fitting the lift pump I noticed improvement in low RPMs response. Another positive event is that if you your own servicing priming the fuel system is a breeze as well.

As with the chip vs remap, there is no contest remap wins heands down.  I have Safari Dtronic chip sitting on the shelf as a paper weight now, sure it made some improvements over stock setup but nothing sort of expectations the glossy ads make it up to be. See this ==> NIssan Patrol ECU re-map

The problem with GU4 series ZD30 is that Nissan was rather too conservative on the emission side and made control system to go in to limp mode at slightest whiff of sensory overload so just fitting diesel chip will cause issues instantly. Fitting Dawes and needle valve causes the same so any gain power/performance will come back adn bite if the limps are not taken care of....

Re-mapped ECU has no such problems as re-map removes those silly limps and other performance limiting parameters set there to comply with whatever idiotic ideas they had at the time.

Honestly, the re-map output is so much that it makes me wondering what it does to the engine reliability even though ZD30 has it pretty low from the factory anyway.

To summarize, re-map is less hassle, cost about the same as piggy back chip and as long as you don't mind black smoke the performance output is nothing short of incredible I kid you not. And as someone who had a fair share of mods induced limps and attempts to beat them I would not go back to original factory tune ever again.

Regards

So is it still worth putting the daws system on the gu4 or just do the fuel lift pump and ecu remap. im also looking at putting an exhaust on it aswell. Also fitting the fuel lift pump will help the cooling and lubrication aswell or is that a seperate thing again??

Sorry about all these questions but i just want to know witch is the best way to go for my gu4 before i start buying bit and peices.

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7 hours ago, Craig Holman said:

So is it still worth putting the daws system on the gu4 or just do the fuel lift pump and ecu remap. im also looking at putting an exhaust on it aswell. Also fitting the fuel lift pump will help the cooling and lubrication aswell or is that a seperate thing again??

Sorry about all these questions but i just want to know witch is the best way to go for my gu4 before i start buying bit and peices.

Well it is really your choice. However if you do go down re-map route technicaly you don't need Dawes valve system to put in, "Geeyoutoo" has re-experimented and refitted factory boost control solenoid back in and apparently it works quite well with re-maped ECU. (one of the reasons we fit Dawes/Tilix and needle valve system is to take away control of the turbo from factory setup ECU to make sure that boost is not dropped off during the cruise when ECU also opens EGR valve which is a big problem, however with re-mapped ECU this is taken care off as a part of the re-map modification)

Personally I'd still combine the systems if wanting to retain existing factory boost control, that is: fit Tilix valve instead of Dawes and retain factory boost control solenoid with re-mapped ECU. That way you can control max boost spikes with Tilix and have the ECU controlling the boost as well which saves you on meddling with spool up rate of the turbo.

As with the lift pump yes it will also improve cooling and lube by delivering more fuel in to the injection pump. You must modify fuel spill line (so called spill line mod) before fitting lift pump though otherwise you'll have major issue/failure.

You must understand that these mods work together and screw up everything in standalone configuration. So just fitting a bigger exhaust will have consequences which are not positive if no other mods are performed (it will limp like crazy everytime you are too eager on go pedal)

*Modify fuel spill line (re-routing it to fuel return line to fuel tank instead as factory done plummed to suction line at the injection pump inlet)

*Fit electric fuel lift pump

*Fit re-mapped ECU ,you can/could keep your original ECU and ask for another ECU (second hand if they have one which will add extra $$$ to your bill but if things go "South" you always have the original,  talk to the gents first.

*Fit Tilix valve (same as Dawes but works better and is locally sourced)  Tee it in and set it up for max boost of 22-24 psi with OEM boost control solenoid

*Fit bigger exhaust.

 

 

Regards

Edited by Rumcajs

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11 hours ago, Ghost said:

Sorry coming in late to the dicsussion, I am assuming this mod can be applied to D22 Navara with ZD30 DDT?

D22 Navara ZD30 uses different fuel and turbo management.

It has fixed geometry turbo (so No  you can't use Dawes or Tilix and needle valve) you can use waste gate by pass valve like from Turbo smart or Boost Tee or similar.

There is no MAF so no need for voltage modifier of that signal unless you want to apply it to MAP/boost sensor,  indeed Navara is easier to mod in regards to turbo pressure

All the other mods you can do.

Regards

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